Freedom of Religion Under Attack!

Note–This isn’t a happy, cheerful post about kittens and daisies. It’s an angry post about religious freedoms. If you prefer to keep things of this nature out of your mind then it would be best to skip this post and simply read the others.

First Amendment

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

I am outraged at the way our government is treating the FLDS ladies and children. In America we are innocent until proven guilty. Every child protection agency in our country gives us lip service that it’s their intent to keep families together whenever possible. Yet the courts have already assumed these ladies are guilty and taken away their children.

They’re doing it because of a phone call from a girl claiming she was abusedThe phone call  was fake, yet the courts are continuing with their plans to keep the children away from their parents.

I am a religious woman. I dress plainly and wear a headcovering most of the time. I look different from mainstream America. Why do I do it? Because the bible commands me, as a Christian, to be separate from the rest of the world.

2 Corinthians 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord.

I show my separation through my my behavior, my words and my dress. Yes, I am submissive to my husband. He is the authority in our household. I am not submissive to all men. I do not think men are inherently more valuable or intelligent than women. The bible specifically instructs women to submit to their own husbands as unto the Lord.

Ephesians 5:22 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord.

Colossians 3:18 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as it is fit in the Lord.

Submitting to my husband in no way makes me brainwashed. It doesn’t make me less of a person, or display my lack of value. On the contrary, I am especially valuable and God’s instructions are evidence of how special I am to Him. Yes I dress funny, but this also is evidence of my value. The bible instructs us to dress modestly and says specifically that women should have long hair.

1 Timothy 2:9 In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with braided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array.

1 Corinthians 11:15 But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering.

When I see these beautiful, virtuous, Christian women being persecuted by the state and I read that their children are being forced into foster care, because their parents have shielded from the world, the way the bible instructs us to, I am so angry I can’t think straight. I honestly find myself at a loss for words.

 I don’t agree with all of the tenets of Fundamental Mormonism. As a Fundamental Independent Baptist I differ with them on many issues. Be that as it may, they are fellow women in Christ. They are following the Bible in many ways and I respect them for that because I know how hard it is to be a religious weird-o in our modern world.

While there are definite doctrinal differences, I still identify with these ladies. I homeschool my children. I teach them things that the Government probably doesn’t want them to know, like the Constitution, and the role that Christianity has played in the foundation of our country. I teach them how far we have strayed as a nation from our Founding Father’s original intentions. I teach them that Religious Persecution is WRONG! And I am old enough to realize that if our country persecutes Fundamental Mormons today, that Fundamentalist of all faiths are in danger of being persecuted tomorrow.

I believe that Christians, as a group, have an obligation to protect others religious freedoms because if we don’t protect theirs, who will protect ours? By making it illegal for FLDS to practice their faith openly we are fostering an environment of secrecy and darkness which promotes abuse in the first place. When a man (Warren Jeffs) sets himself up as God, there will be consequences. God will see to that. But that is God’s job, not the government’s. Persecuting these people, instead of allowing them to live openly, merely tightens the hold Jeffs has over them. It confirms his authority instead of diminishing it; forcing the women deeper into secrecy instead of allowing them to blossom in the light.

I remember the Branch Davidians in Waco, Texas and how the government seized their compound in part to “protect the children.” Several days later I witnessed the compound go down in flames as the government, who claimed they were protecting the children, burned them to a cinder with the same efficiency that Nazi’s incinerated children in concentration camps.

I do not trust the government to have these children’s best interest in mind. I think they have political motivations, which are not universally well intended. My government is betraying it’s people. Ebbing away at our fundamental rights a little at a time, and expecting us to turn a blind eye. It reminds me of a story I heard in high school about a girl who was dating this guy. He kept trying to bring down her defenses, wearing away at them day after day. Finally he begged her “Just the tip, that’s all.” She acquiesced, and that was the end of her virtue. The government is begging us, “just the tip, that’s all, nothing more.” Scientist tell us the tip of the iceberg, the part we can see, is the smallest part. It’s the part we can’t see that we need to worry about.

Luke 6:22 Blessed are ye, when men shall hate you, and when they shall separate you from their company, and shall reproach you, and cast out your name as evil, for the Son of man’s sake.

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46 Comments

Filed under Rants

46 responses to “Freedom of Religion Under Attack!

  1. Christian Prophet

    I viewed the video exposing the Texas Foster Care system as drug-riddled horror at:
    http://dayofpraise.blogspot.com/

    I also read the thousand or so comments from outraged citizens at the petition site:
    http://www.thepetitionsite.com/2/free-the-innocent-flds

    It seems state bureaucrats have become power mad.

  2. I had no idea there was a petition. I agree 100%, they are power-mad. Thank-you for sharing.

  3. cbrunette

    Oh Maggie, I was simmering on this issue, too! You have done much better justice to the issue than I could written.

    From one public religious weird-o to another,

    ~Anna

  4. Oh, thankyou Anna. My personal opinion about the validity of FLDS beliefs isn’t the issue. The issue is that we all have Freedom of Religion and that means Freedom From Religious persecution. I’m absolutely livid that the government thinks they have the right to do this. So mad that I can’t even think straight on the issue. I just see red. 😉 Religious Weird-O’s unite. 😉

  5. I have very mixed feelings on this subject. I have a very vested interest in religious rights. My religion has had to fight for our rights for years.

    But I have a very hard time seperating that fact with what seems to be some of the practices of the FLDS. There have been many times over the years where it has been found that the FLDS have forced young girls into marriage. Although it seems to be with much OLDER men, to me that makes little difference…I have a problem with forcing young girls into marriage.

    I am praying that this matter is handled in the best way possible, and that if these girls are being forced into marriages, that the men will be removed from having any influence in their lives.

    (I hope that makes sense)

  6. Hi One Frugal Mom, I feel your conflict too. I have prayed on it extensively, because it makes me feel mixed up. I am a mom and it’s my job to advocate for children, I think it’s every mom’s job. I think that like in every community, there is some abuse taking place. But the government would have been better served addressing these individual cases, rather than a mass movement like they’ve made.

    I think it was lazy of the government to react they way they did, lumping everyone in the same basket. This is what makes it religious persecution. I believe it’s possible to address the situation without resorting to this type of bevaior. I don’t believe that religious persecution was necessary in this instance. And the fact that the government deemed it reasonable scares the snot out of me.

  7. Sheree

    Miss Maggie said:
    Oh, thankyou Anna. My personal opinion about the validity of FLDS beliefs isn’t the issue. The issue is that we all have Freedom of Religion and that means Freedom From Religious persecution. I’m absolutely livid that the government thinks they have the right to do this. So mad that I can’t even think straight on the issue. I just see red. Religious Weird-O’s unite.
    [end quote]

    Miss Maggie, I have to say that I absolutely and 100% feel this way, too.
    It isn’t that I agree with their practices at all, but I see what you are seeing and I am livid that the state of Texas thinks they have the right to do this. It won’t end there. And another thing, while I dont’ agree with having child brides, there are girls as young as 12 & 13 having babies all across the US…why are they still with their parents? Why are these women and children being punished because someone wanted to make a false allegation…not to mention the damage that is resulting from those children being in foster homes that do not have the religious beliefs that they have been taught their whole lives…..where will this end?
    And another thing, before they go worrying about what FLDS is teaching their children, why aren’t they worrying about how the muslims are teaching their children even here in the US? Its far worse than what FLDS is teaching theirs!!!
    Okay, I best get off my soap box before I write a huge long post about it!
    I just agree with you completely about this.

  8. wilkinson4jesus

    Oh Maggie,
    I would disagree with the FLDS on many things, but like was said above “My personal opinion about the validity of FLDS beliefs isn’t the issue.” They say they keep families together whenever possible. But that is only if you fit their mold, and jump through their hoops. They have way to much power and something needs to be done to restrain them before they take all the Christian children away because we do not support the gay agenda or are not pro-evolution.
    We also are glad to religious weird-o’s and wounder because we do not fit their mold, are going to targeted next??? Sad isn’t it.

    Excellent post Miss Maggie, Thanks!

  9. jenny

    Hi Maggie,
    i have enjoyed browsing through your site and was so glad to hear your strong opinion on this apparent religious persecution. Although, as others have stated, I don’t agree with polygamous sects beliefs, (and also don’t agree with many of your own!) I thankyou for expressing yourself, and have learnt from what you have said.
    Perhaps there may be some occurences of abuse in the FLDS group but the goverment’s reaction seems to be opportunism to get into and harrass the group.
    FLDS are probably easy to pick on because many people find their beliefs and customs unusual and unattractive. Where is the line drawn? I thought that America was founded on principles of religious freedom. I am Australian, and although we are generally very unreligious here, I think a lot more is tolerated.
    thanks again

  10. I am a Muslim woman, who covers her hair for modesty and definitely is considered a “weirdo” as well. I think the post was excellent. So I won’t restate your well said position as I wholeheartedly agree. But I would add as a former social worker that they did have other options.
    1. They could have removed the FATHERS!!! If they felt the fathers were potential abusers.
    2. They could have removed only the teen aged girls who were in immediate jeopardy. And left the rest of the children until they could determine the FACTS.
    3. They could have left “observers” To remain on-site, for mothers or children who were in danger to turn to, until the FACTS were determined. (This would have been highly unsual but MUCH LESS DAMAGING than taking 417 children away from the only home and lifestyle they have ever known.

    I worry about the brain-washing, these children will now be undergoing. As a Muslim if my child were taken away I would hope they would be placed with a family that would support and encourage them to continue practicing our Islamic faith. As a soicalworker I KNOW that most foster families, take the children to their worship services and force the children to practice their beliefs. The younger the child the more the child is subjected to his/her new families beliefs and practices. I can only imagine how damaging that would be for these children.

    The only other thing I would add is that the State of Texas should prepare for the biggest class action lawsuit they have ever had!!!

  11. I am a member of the LDS church (not the FLDS) and I am heart sick at what is happening. While I don’t believe in a lot of the things they do, or their life style, I think the government should butt out! It is a very scary step in a very scary direction. I wonder how long it will be before our liberal government will decided that I am wrong in teaching my daughters that they should be mothers and wives and that that is the best thing, and most glorious thing they can do with their lives. So wrong in fact that they will decide our children need to be taken from us so they won’t be “brain washed”.

    I also have another big beef with what they are doing. Why are they not going after the hundreds of thousands of men who have several children with several diffrent ladies. Why is that not as wrong as poligamy? I don’t agree with either life style, but serioulsy lets be consistant!

    This whole thing bothers me, to my core!

  12. Saffiyah makes a great point. Why didn’t they take the Men out of the compound? Because the gov’t is lazy. It’s easier to remove compliant women and children. The men would have put up a fight.

    Aimee I worry too. There are so many more significant ills in America. Many pointed out by you and other commetners. The only reason I can see that the government is reacting the way it has is because FLDS look different and have a different belief structure. Someone should read Dr. Seuss’s “The Sneetches” to the government of Texas and see if they get the point. To me this is a case of “Stars upon thars.”

  13. Saffiyah, I worry about the kids in foster care too. I’m remembering when the American Government took Native Americans out of their homes and sent them to boarding schools to rob them of their culture.

    I appreciate your insight as a social worker, and another religous weird-o. I’m hoping that, like you predict, Texas will have to face a class-action law suit and that they will finally learn their lesson about religious freedoms. Waco didn’t teach it to them. Maybe this will.

  14. ms anthropy

    Christians are subject to temporal laws–“render unto Caesar that which is Caesar’s”. No religious group should get away with pedophilia masquerading as piety. Read Carolyn Jessop’s book about her experiences with the FLDS on their compound in southern Utah. You might have a different perspective then.

  15. alice

    I think you’re mischaracterizing several things in your emotional reaction.

    1) None of the children have been placed in foster care. They are in protective custody until the fact are established and a hearing on them can be held.
    2) All of the charges are about the safety of minor children and the laws of TX.
    3) If evidence of statutory rape and bigamy is wanted, the perpetrators are not the likely witnesses to it.
    4) Where the original phone call came from (and it’s still not certain it came from outside the YfZ) is immaterial if, on investigating the call, the investigators found underage mothers and pregnant women.

    You are feeling defensive about your “otherness”. It does not follow that investigating law breaking and abuse in one “other-ish” community leads to your being investigated. And the 100 year existence of overtly polygamous communities in UT is evidence of that.

    Relax and be grateful that some rapacious middle aged men may not be able to continue using religion to force themselves on 14 year old girls.

  16. Leta

    I, too, have been conflicted about this. America was founded on freedom of religion. I disagree with all sorts of religions, but I believe that God reaches different people in different ways, and if someone who believes differently from me is wrong, well, that’s not my business. That’s between God and the individual, you know?

    On the other hand, if there’s anything that’s going to make me support big scary government interference, it’s child abuse. I fear that the gov’t knows that, and, in this case, may be using that to their advantage, at least as far as PR is concerned.

    I am concerned about the precedent this sets. I am appalled at the idea that children could be taken away from any loving, non-abusive home, no matter the marital/sexual arrangements of the parents, because foster care is a NIGHTMARE.

    However, everything I have read about the FLDS church, especially from former members, is that girls are routinely married off at 12 or 13, forced into pregnancy, and boys are run off on a rail at the same age, to ensure a high ratio of women for the church elders. This is child abuse and neglect, which is illegal, and should be prosecuted. Point blank.

    But what Miss Maggie said is true: by taking non-abusive women, and children who are not abused, the gov’t has turned this valid prosecution into religious persecution, and that is wrong.

    I dunno. This is a quandry for me.

    I’m no lawyer, but maybe what we need is some sort of law that says no minor may live with two or more adults who are unrelated to them. (Step parents would count as a relative.) That way, at least no girl could legally enter into a polygamous relationship until she was at least 18. Because that, I think, is the most important thing here, that the women who choose this lifestyle for themselves be old enough to legally consent.

    Oh, and one more thing: Where are the FLDS men in this? I haven’t seen a thing about them. The women, on the other hand, are on Larry King and the cover of People magazine. It seems that they are being cast out to defend this church in a sympathy effort for PR purposes. That makes me angry. You should stand by your spouse if it’s a truly loving relationship, and that works both ways.

    Yep, I’m in a quandry all right.

  17. Poem by Pastor Martin Niemoller, quoted from Time Magazine

    First they came for the Communists, and I didn’t speak up, because I wasn’t a Communist.
    Then they came for the Jews, and I didn’t speak up, because I wasn’t a Jew.
    Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn’t speak up, because I was a Protestant.
    Then they came for me, and by that time there was no one left to speak up for me.

  18. I think we have to be very careful when we condem these FLDS men. I do not believe they are as bad as eveybody likes to make them out to be. They have been raised this way, their fathers and father’s fathers took young brides. I don’t think they are all pediphoils (oh bad spelling!) I think they are just brought up to think that this is ok. I think we should be treating them with compassion, along with the very young mothers that are being seperated from their children.

    I don’t believe their life style is right, and I am not trying to excuse them. I am just trying understand where these people are comming from.

  19. Kelli

    If this situation does not wake people up in this country, nothing will. We are on a slippery slope, folks. If you think this just affects “them,” you’re wrong. The last thing we need to do is relax. I have two boys. They are two-years-old and five months. The more I think about this situation, I just feel physically sick. What if your children were taken away because of a phone call? These are babies who need their mamas. The grief must be shattering. When will the government decide that my husband and I, as Christians who follow the Bible, are abusing our children because we teach them that Satan is real? Will the government decide that we are psychologically abusing and depriving our children because we limit their exposure to popular culture trash? We need to WAKE UP!

  20. Beth

    I think that some things need to be clarified. First, the women and children are in protective custody. In ANY case, this would happen, and when abuse is the problem being looked into, the child is taken away from the parent who, to the police, is allowing it to happen. The women are not charged with anything, they have not been arrested. It would be irresponsible for the state to leave the children at risk when they have reason to believe that they would be at risk if left alone. The men CAN’T be arrested until there is the evidence to do so.

    Second, they are breaking the laws in order to practice their religion. If that were tolerated, many people would do awful things and then site Freedom of religion. I agree with ms anthropy, ”render unto Caesar that which is Caesar’s”.

    This isn’t the first, second, or even the third time that this group of people has been warned of their law breaking actions. This has been an ongoing issue when they lived in Southern UT and Northern AZ.

    With that, let me say that my heart and prayers go out to these children. I can’t imagine being separated from my children. I am saddest for these little ones who are in a culture that they may have chosen not to be a part of it they were given a chance. I feel the same way for children of many other extreme groups of people, Islam comes to mind immediately.

  21. Beth

    I forgot to say that this has nothing to do with religious intolerance. If that were the case, they would have been arrested the second they moved in. Their ways of life were not a secret, they could have done something then if it were a religious thing. Instead, the state did nothing until there was something reported. This would have been handled the same way whether it was another religious group or no religious group at all.

  22. Beth

    In reading my first post, I need to clarify. It is not Islam that I have a problem with, it is Extremist Islam (the group of people who want to blow up Christian infidels).

  23. Gary

    There are several problems that have happened. First it’s the law where anyone can call law enforcement and make accusations without evidence. Then the police who want/need their arrest numbers to justify their budgets, love to jump on something like the potential for polygamy with a possible connection to the Mormon faith and Warren Jeffs.
    What we as a country have lost here, is freedom! The legislators are killing what little freedoms we have left. This is not that different than the Waco, TX disaster. I personally think that law enforcement restricted access to the media so they could control the release of information in the case. Who knows if, or how many lies and false information have been released to sway conviction in law enforcements favor. Otherwise the truth in Waco and in this case would cost the law enforcers their careers, their integrity, and more.
    The media and the public are spoon fed the information law enforcement wants released, to justify their means.
    Example: You have a neighbor who you don’t like. You decide (for whatever reason) that you want to rid yourself of them, or at least create problems in their lives. So you anonymously make a fictitious story about how your neighbors have sexually abused their children.
    The next thing you know there are dozens of police cars surrounding their home, the neighborhood is evacuated and cordoned off, the media is subdued and all information to the media is obtained through an official law enforcement spokesperson.
    The police will say they have found some evidence, though they won’t say what it is. So the public thinks wow, how could this happen here?
    Meanwhile the perpetrator (you) are anonymously safe from scrutiny and you have just inflicted some serious damage to you neighbors freedoms and life.
    In order to accurately appraise a situation this raid should have been done with the media’s cameras turned on during the initial invasion of the ranch. Notice I didn’t say compound (which would be the politically correct way law enforcement would like it released to the public.
    The persecution of these people was caused by nothing more than an anonymous phone call and they still haven’t found the originator of that phone call. So who should we believe? Those who control and release information in a situation, or those who have not yet been heard? There are two sides to every story, and we’ve only heard the one that justified using armored vehicles, controlled what information was released to the public, restricted media access, and have yet to release proof positive evidence, other than stating a bed was located in the church.

  24. Beth

    Just to clarify, FLDS has NO ties to the LDS (Mormon) religion. They claim it, themselves. There is no affiliation.

  25. Rick

    For those who keep pushing the evil pedophile and forced subjugation of girls and women into marriages, you may want to get real facts first. People like to trot out Carolyn adn Flora Jessop as proof they are all bad, but their own sisters disagree with them. Flora has given such consistently bad info to the AZ attourney’s office that they don’t listen to her anymore.
    The legal marriage age in Texas was 14, until the FLDS moved in. The law was specifically changed to target them. This is well documented. So, how was it ok for other Texans to marry at 14 bit the FLDS are pedophiles?
    The media uses terms like pedophiles, child brides, compund, cult, seperatists, etc to justify this action. This is typical propoganda.
    If there are cases of abuse (I’m sure there are), the answere is to go after each one. Instead, this state-run travesty will cover up real problems and perpetuate the us vs them attitude.
    Look how the press reports how the government is against them – it seems to me the FLDS were right on. This isn’t the first time (not even the second time) this group has been under attack. If people are out to get me, it means I’m not paranoid.

  26. Deana

    That is interesting what Rick has posted about marriage age laws in Texas. I looked up online marriage laws in many states and under the right circumstances (usually parental consent sometimes with added juvenile court consent) marriages as young as 14 are permitted. I think that really is too young (and would think it horrible if forced or not voluntary) but it is not unusual. Many cultures/countries have young marriages. In years past they were quite common. The famous country singer Lorretta Lynn was married at 13. Julliet in Shakespear’s “Romeo and Julliet” was suppose to be around 14. However, they should deal with individual cases. Not all the children were in supposed danger only teenage girls. (and I don’t personally think even that)- It is just a horrible situation all around. I feel so bad for the moms and children.

  27. let's be careful!

    Oh, Maggie, let’s be careful!!
    We can sympathize with the plight of these women. We can pray for them, & for their children.
    We can pray, too, for our own rights to be protected.

    But let’s make no mistake: These are NOT “fellow women in Christ” They are not Christian at all. FLDS believe in many gods, like the heathen who dragged down the Children of Israel back in Bible days. They worship their departed leaders as gods, & hope to be “goddesses” someday.
    This is a tragedy. But it is also a warning, for all Christians, to be careful, not to embrace too closely those in our midst who may well be already in the grip of the forces of the antichrist!!

  28. Anonymous

    Actully, they don’t worship their leaders, they just love them. And, if we are made in the image of Christ, wouldn’t it stand to reason that we could be like Him in every way if we turn to Him in everything we do. That would mean that we could eventually be gods and goddesses, too. I’m not FLDS, just saying…

  29. Humburger

    Mormons are NOT Christians. However, that aside, religious freedom is their right, also. It is unconstitutional and just plain wrong what has been done and continues to be done with these people. And most of America is okay with it. It makes my blood boil.

  30. I’m with you Maggie, “Religious Weird-O’s unite”! I can relate to these families, even though i’ve gotten a smaller taste of this sort of thing than they. But it has happened. Even through simply blogging its happened, since being (a returned) Catholic like i am is sure not always welcomed in Christian homemaking circles, and it can get pretty hurtful. Its still unbelievable the hateful mail (unpublished) that comes in sometimes when there’s been writing about Our Blessed Mother especially, and also the tradition of holy poverty can bring in harsh mail, even on a little low traffic blog like mine. Have had plenty of Bible verses thrown at me through this kind of thing, like i’m the enemy and that’s the weapon to use… never mind that the Bible is my guide as well and i long just as much as they do to live a Christian life. Its just so hurtful. And using “legal protection” as a weapon is just as bad, as happened (and of course SO much worse) in Texas. Whether its under the pretense of Scripture or “protection” , i think we should just call hate and power hunger exactly what it is. And its scary stuff.

    Bravo for standing up to this! Think i better start paying attention to the news more.

    Peaceful Week, Wendy

  31. janet parks

    i am one more weirdo,headcovering,modest apperal, homeschooling ,i truly belive in religious freedom but the bible also tells us to obey the laws of the land and poligamy is aganist the law in the united states
    i have skipped a few days reading your blog miss maggie and boy did i miss a lot,never again i will be here every day from now on

  32. Hey Janet, I don’t often get on a roll like this, so if you only check once a week that’s fine. 🙂

    Wendy, I didn’t know you were Catholic. I do know what you mean about being on the receiving end of religious attacks. It can be very ouch-y at times.

    You wrote–“Whether its under the pretense of Scripture or “protection” , i think we should just call hate and power hunger exactly what it is. And its scary stuff. ” Amen Sister. Couldn’t agree with you more.

  33. janet parks

    i watched an interview with some of the women they were asked about their clothing and hair ,they said it was just a choice ,it made my heart hurt ,now ya’ll know they could have quoted the scriptures to these people ,but if they had they would have been labled ,religious zealots,jesus freaks or any of a hundered other things ,i hurt so for these women,most of my neighbors think i am strange ,here in the bible belt south i just dont know how this can be allowed to happen

  34. mel

    Sis, living with this, talking to the people involved, the media is not doing it justice.
    First of all, laws, actual federal laws were broken.
    They are not being persecuted for religion. they are being prosecuted for breaking the laws of TX and the USA. If it helps, place the children with law abiding LDS families.
    Taking a 13 year old girl to bed is a capitol crime if the man is 3 or more years older than the girl.
    The children repeat, each day as a mantra, smile, pray sweetly obey. Which is fine unless you live with a molester. These children do not even know what crayons are. No toys have yet been found on the compound. Their lives are all school and work.
    The situation is sad, but under the law of this country, the right steps have been taken. This was not something that was done on a whim. It has been coming for 5 years.
    Aside from that this community is reaching out, loving these kids. The nursing moms are being allowed to remain with babes.
    It saddens me that the Christian community is blindly accepting what the media is showing, which is being skewed to rile up emotion.

  35. Please visit http://fldsmormons.blogspot.com/ A picture is worth a thousandwords.

  36. Merle

    I am a liberal, middle aged Jew and I believe what was done to those families, to those children was and is abominable. It is not my place to judge whether or not a polygamous marriage is right or wrong for didn’t our Fathers have multiple wives? I will leave it in G-d’s hands. Our government has overstepped it bounds and damaged our citizens. Lest the State of Texas forget, these *are* still American citizens.

  37. Homeschool Mom

    Hi Miss Maggie,

    Really enjoy your site … Now that a couple months have passed since this situation began, and the Texas 3rd court of appeals has weighed in on the matter, I think we all can look back and see exactly where the Texas CPS overstepped thier bounds. The TX appeals courts have ordered the children back with thier mothers because the methods TX CPS used in removing these children was ILLEGAL. TX CPS did not follow the laws they’ve worked so hard themselves to pass. Laws are not only designed to protect citizens from other un-lawful citizens but also to protect citizens from Gestapo government agencies.

    I do not agree with the FLDS religion, however, just because I disagree with someone’s religion does not make it acceptable for anyone or any agency to pursucute them. If I turn a blind eye to thier plight today, my day of presuction will come sooner than I wish.

    I certainly hope and pray that the FLDS slap the state TX CPS and the Eldorado law enforcement agency with a HUGE lawsuit. The state handled this situation in an illegal manner and the state should pay.

    Thank you for your time.

  38. Linda

    I find the “just the tip” analogy alittle ironic when you descirbe the involvement of the government. I think the anolgy also applies to The FLDS men, don’t you think? Rick, I don’t know if you have daughters or not, but just try to get me to allow my 14 year old daughter to marry a 45 year old man–OVER MY DEAD BODY!!! No sane parent would ever let that happen no matter what religion they belong to. We are talking about allegations of pedophelia and polygamy, not homeschooling and dress. My suspicion is that if they all wore monkey masks and howled at the moon and called it their religion you would not be nearly as sympathetic to their plight as you are to these women who dress as “modest Christian” women. This was not an attack on a group’s religious freedom, but rather an attempt to protect children who cannot protect themselves. We fight as Christians to protect life in the womb, and we would never accept to premise of abortion as acceptable religious expression. Who in their right mind would conclude that men can have 13 year old wives as accepted religious expression and thus procted under the constitution? Both should be investigated and prosicuted as a matter of child protection regardless of religion. Disagreements aside, I love your site and gleen from it regularly.

  39. Anonymous

    Religion being under attack is the start of the great tribulation every riligion is going to fall exept the true one that Jehovah God will save in armagedon! It is all in the bible “flee from false religion”

  40. Anonymous

    Revelacion or apocolyps 18:4 “And I heard another voice out of Heaven say: ‘Get out of her, my people, if you do not want to share with her in her sins, and if you do not want to receieve part of her plagues.'”

  41. Anonymous

    Prophecies of ancient Babylon’s fall in the Hebrew scriptures also include Jehovah’s command to his people : “Take your flight out of the mist of babylon.”-Jeremiah. 50:8,13-

  42. Anonymous

    Similarity, in view of the coming desolation of Babylon the great-the false religions-God’s people are urged to escape. In 537 B.C.E the opportunity to escape from Bbylon caused much rejoiceing on the part of faithful Israerlites. In the same way, the realease of Gods’s people from Babylonish captivity in 1919 led to rejoicing on thier part. (Revelacion. 11:11,12) And since that time millions of other people have obeyed the order to flee- compare Mathew. 24:15,16-

  43. Anonymous

    Do all religions lead to God?
    Does hell really exist, like most religions say?
    How can you get close to God?
    Or have any question or comment on what i said, mail me at: anonymousperson19@hotmail.com

  44. Anonymous

    How can I survie the end of the world and not “recieve part of her plagues”?

  45. Anonymous

    The end of false religion no one can stop because the bible says that god will put in the heart of the government to destroy it, and once that happens those who are in it will “share in it’s destruction and then is when everyone will know that there was only one true religion but then will be too late so thats why everyone has to act now the evidence is here would you go for cover if there were to be a hurrican or a tornado? Of course we all would the signs for those things are dark skys well the skys are dark symbiloiclay we all have been warned it is up too us if we want to take cover under Jehovah God’s Protection!!!!!!!!!! Please flee from “her”!!! Just Like God Says”

  46. Victoria

    I know this blog is a bit old, but I thought I’d point out that there were actually SEVERAL issues with the specific compound in question long before the fake phone call. The 1st was the large amount of young boys they were ex-communicating that had absolutely NO idea how to live in the outside world (because there weren’t enough women to go around, boys were routinely ex-communicated)–there’s actually an agency called ‘the lost boys’ whose purpose is to educate the boys. This wasn’t a religious issue, it was a welfare issue. The 2nd issue was the girls and women who were trapped there–cars carried no insurance or tags on them, and the women themselves weren’t allowed licenses–some of whom escaped and told social workers first-hand what kind of ‘abuse’ they themselves had endured and the abuse they had witnessed. Private investigators had been following this case since they established the compound, and the phone call was simply the straw that broke the camels back. Now, why were the children completely separated from their fathers AND mothers??? Well, because the abuse was not exclusively the mens’ fault. Mothers were also the perpetrators of the extremely young marriage age–because they were taught it was Biblical. The complete family unit MUST consist of three women and a man in order to enter heaven. The father of the compound’s leader had 200 wives himself. I think that over time, the idea of completely separating the children from BOTH parents was made for their welfare–even if outsiders didn’t see the mothers as ‘dangerous’. The atmosphere in the compound was extremely competitive because if you weren’t a good ‘mother’, you could be ex-communicated and your children given to a new ‘mother’ or be assigned to a completely different family. The threat of losing your children was greater than marrying off your fourteen-year-old–and since you couldn’t live outside the compound even if you got there, this was your real life. Freeing the women and the children from those confines was probably an extremely difficult decision to make, but sometimes it’s difficult to figure out where the line is between abuse and religion. At what point was this compound crossing the line?? When was did it turn from a peaceful community to an official case with human services?? I know there’s a lot more to this case than meets the eye, and unfortunately that’s because workers aren’t going to be going to any press conferences and spilling the beans about the whens and whys of their investigation. So, America was left hanging–wondering why the children were taken and how a government agency could be soo cruel. I think the thing we have to think about in this case is: is it ok for a religion to not give you a choice? If you are fourteen and you don’t want to marry–should you be facing ex-communication? Isn’t that abandonment? The compound was not held responsible for the hundreds of boys AND girls they were literally driving out to the middle of nowhere and leaving to die, and they weren’t being held responsible for forcing their girls to marry before it is legal for them to do so–bearing whole families before they are even legal adults. Now they are. Religion should not hurt your children–that’s abuse. I know Christ would not have approved of this kind of treatment towards children.

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